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Unread 03-30-2005, 12:34 PM   #1
Yankel Nosson
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Tuesday 18 Adar II

Kvod Maran Harav Ovadia Yosef, Shlita:

"All the goyim wll be cut down -- they can go to Azazel! All the talk about disengagement from Gush Katif is only temporary. Immediately (tekef umiyad) Moshiach will come!! He is already at our gates! Very shortly he will knock on the door: "I am coming! Ahlan w'sahlan!" Moshiach will come and then -- who are all these dogs (enemies of Israel)? He will throw them to Azazel in the desert! He will return the crown of old, and all of Eretz Yisroel will be ours forever!"

Video: http://gog.web-site.co.il/gog/marang3.asx
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Unread 03-30-2005, 05:01 PM   #2
Aharon Benjamin
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ain davar omed bifnei hateshuvah

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yankel Nosson
Tuesday 18 Adar II

Kvod Maran Harav Ovadia Yosef, Shlita:

"All the goyim wll be cut down -- they can go to Azazel! ...

Shalom R'Yankel Nosson, with all due respect - I have the following arguments to offer:

1. first of all, if I am not mistaken in saying so - the Rabbi who you are quoting here was refused yechidus with the Rebbe, since he was supporting the returning of Land to the Arabs in Israel. (I am assuming that this is not lashon hara since it is publically known already). How much credence then, should we, as aspiring Chabad Chassidim give to the views of this Rabbi who the Rebbe refused to meet with?

2. One of the sayings of Rabbi Nachman of Breslev (who you refer to on your website, www.yiddishkeit.org) is that "tamid efshar letaken". Do you think that this only applies to Jews but not to Bnai Noach? Or do you believe that the Chabad Shita would differ on this point?

3. Last but not least, on the website www.erevmoshiach.org that you are also involved with, if we are to assume that this boy is a navi emes - which I believe both myself and you do - then we must conclude that his statement that "all of them will convert" is a positive prophetic statement (atleast illustrating a potential for achievement within our reach, other wise it would be in vain) - and therefore is absolute reality as stated by the Rambam in his kakdama to pirush haMishanaos, ch.2.
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Unread 03-30-2005, 07:13 PM   #3
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Quote:
...first of all, if I am not mistaken in saying so - the Rabbi who you are quoting here was refused yechidus with the Rebbe, since he was supporting the returning of Land to the Arabs in Israel. (I am assuming that this is not lashon hara since it is publically known already). How much credence then, should we, as aspiring Chabad Chassidim give to the views of this Rabbi who the Rebbe refused to meet with?
...and the Rebbe also insisted a reference to his sefer be placed (or remain) in LS....
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Unread 03-30-2005, 08:21 PM   #4
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The Rebbe insisted on being goinez the 1st edition of the likut (I think it was shlach, it was definitely about tzitzis), and reprinting it. The only change was a tziun to his sefer in the begining.
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Unread 03-30-2005, 08:32 PM   #5
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Exactly. (LS v 33 Shlach (3)).
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Unread 03-30-2005, 09:58 PM   #6
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the message of Pesach Sheni

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torah613
Exactly. (LS v 33 Shlach (3)).
OK, yashar koach to both of you for bring that to my attention. However, just to note - we also find in pirkei avos that King David gave honor to Achitophel in honor of his Torah knowledge. No, this does not mean that the Rabbi in question is equivilent to Achitophel neccesarily, but it is worth noting anyways.

The point of the discussion here is - that I am suggesting that according to the shita of Chassidus, that it is "always possible to be metaken" as quoted from Rabbi Nachman of Breslev, and this seems to be consistent with the Freiddecher Rebbe's teaching about Pesach Sheni for example, that - "no situation is ever lost". So if there is a difference of opinion between Rabbi Yosef and the shita of Chassidus, then I for one would have to be inclined to take the side of the Chassidim.
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Unread 03-30-2005, 10:41 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aharon Benjamin
Shalom R'Yankel Nosson, with all due respect - I have the following arguments to offer
To respond in brief:

1) If nothing else, R' Ovadia Yosef presently holds in accordance with the Rebbe's position regarding the Land of Israel. If we want to discuss the tshuva of goyim, al achas kama v'kama the tshuva of (lehavdil) a Rav and Posek of good standing.

2) Chassidus differentiates between Bnei Noach, umos ha'olam, goyim, akum--different terms connoting different standing. Regarding Amalek, the simple understanding is as stated: shvirasam zehu tikkunam. I am not so sure that the FR's statement about a tikkun Amalek is in opposition to this, though it might be. There is another thread for this question.

3) Just to clarify, a) I wouldn't classify the statements on www.ErevMoshiach.org as nevuah. Perhaps ruach hakodesh of some sort, but not nevuah, and b) the boy's statements are "pareve" by me until I find supportive sources in Torah. It is precisely because I have been able to validate so many of his statements from the Torah that I made the website to publicize this phenomenon. But I caution on the website (and you need no azhara on this matter, I'm sure) that the final arbiter of emes is Torah and not the words of a little boy no matter how astonishingly accurate his vision may be.

B'kitzur, the concept of "shvirasam zehu tikkunam" is indeed a concept of tikkun. The burden of proof is to show that the FR is implying that there exists a tikkun for Amalek other than shvirasam. I haven't found any supportive sources, however. To the contrary, there is the Rebbe's statement in 5751 about the need for the destruction of those elements which cannot be elevated. Tzorich iyun (in the separate thread)
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Unread 03-30-2005, 10:52 PM   #8
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shvirasam takansam

I looked up this evening what I had seen a week or so ago, in the Gutnick edition Chumash, VaYikrah p.43 (parshas Tzav) "The Last Word" - the Rebbe is quoted from a sicha of parshas Tzav 5736 as having said with regards to shvirasam takanasam - that the body that has sinned (gimmel kelipos) - needs to be broken, however a broken heart is sufficient to bring about this tikkun as well rather than breaking the whole body.

Please refer me to the other thread that you mentioned. Thank you.
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Unread 03-30-2005, 11:25 PM   #9
Torah613
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Has anyone else heard this story of R' Yosef being refused yechidus by the Rebbe? Who says he ever tried to meet the Rebbe? Was he even in America since coming out with his position? When did he publicize his position? (Actually, I have a bit of a maaseh listor, VAKM).
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Unread 03-31-2005, 12:21 AM   #10
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Also should be pointed out that "refused yechidus" could mean various things (thus Reichman could be considered to be in the category, and R' pinchas Menachem of Ger (b/4 he was Rebbe) etc.)
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Unread 04-07-2005, 11:04 AM   #11
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B'Nissan nigalu u-b'Nissan asidin l'higael

The Yeshiva of Mekubalim in Jerusalem:
We anticipate that in Chodesh Nissan the complete redemption will come!

In the Yeshiva of the mekubalim "Nahar Shalom" in Jerusalem they are anticipating that the geulah will arrive this year in the month of Nissan. Thus informs the Rosh Yeshiva, Rav Beniyahu Shmueli, shlita, in his weekly drasha broadcast via sattelite and over the internet. The Rav called upon Am Yisroel to strengthen themselves (lehis'chazek) in Torah and Mitzvos in the remaining days before the month of Nissan.

http://gog.web-site.co.il/
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Unread 04-07-2005, 03:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wannabe
Also should be pointed out that "refused yechidus" could mean various things (thus Reichman could be considered to be in the category, and R' pinchas Menachem of Ger (b/4 he was Rebbe) etc.)
Amen - to R'Yankel's post.

What happened with these Rabbis?
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Unread 04-11-2005, 11:17 AM   #13
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Arrow More Sephardic Tzaddikim declaring imminent geulah

An extremely rare public appearence by the tzaddik and chacham Avraham Chai, shlita, was broadcast via sattelite and over the internet. The purpose was to explain to Jews why specifically now the complete redemption will come, despite the fact that it hasn't come in thousands of years, despite the fact that in earlier generations there were many tzaddikim and great and holy Jews. Similarly, he added that this very month of Nissan in the year 5765 is the month of the promised redemption, and he urged Jews to increase their tshuva, reading of tehillim (psalms) and study of Torah, because right now "the time is very valuable."

View this video recording: http://gog.web-site.co.il/gog/hahamg.asx
also: http://gog.web-site.co.il/gog/bnayahug.asx
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Unread 04-11-2005, 11:42 AM   #14
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Would I be going overboard in exposing my ignorance if I asked who "the tzaddik and chacham avraham Chai Shlita" is
(not ch"v to cool off any form of anticipation for the Geulah) . .
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Unread 04-11-2005, 12:49 PM   #15
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When was the video broadcast (date?) ? I can't read Hebrew.

Thanks,

Moshe
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Unread 04-11-2005, 02:02 PM   #16
Torah613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yankel Nosson
and he urged Jews to increase their tshuva, reading of tehillim (psalms) and study of Torah,
Actually, the quote specified "mussar".
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Unread 04-11-2005, 04:22 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wannabe
Would I be going overboard in exposing my ignorance if I asked who "the tzaddik and chacham avraham Chai Shlita" is
http://rabenu.co.il/ordavid/haham.shtml

I'm sure that will answer all your questions
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Unread 04-12-2005, 05:16 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Torah613
Actually, the quote specified "mussar".
I think it has a slightly different connotation by Sefardim.
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Unread 04-12-2005, 07:17 AM   #19
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Perhaps, but it refers to something specific.
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Unread 04-12-2005, 09:18 AM   #20
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Time line of announcements of Moshiach's Arrival

7th of Elul, 5751 (1991)
Admo"r M'Lubavitch, HaRebbe
One must publicize to all the people of the generation that we have merited that G-d has chosen and appointed a free-willed individual, who is incomparably higher than the people of the generation, to be your judge and your counselor, and the prophet of the generation, and who should provide instruction and advice pertaining to the service of all Jews and all people of the generation, in all matters of Torah and mitzvos, and daily conduct, and matters relating to, In all your ways, know Him, and, All your deeds [should be for the sake of Heaven]. His council extends to the fundamental prophecy, to imminent Redemption, and immediately, literally, Behold he (Moshiach) comes.

Jun 19, 2003
Rav Pinchas Winston
The period of death-resurrection for the entire generation will be long, though righteous people who have died previously will resurrect immediately at the beginning of the period, after the forty years of the ingathering of the exiles. This is what it says in the Midrash, "There will be many resurrections, from the first one after the 40 years of Kibbutz Golios, to the last one at the end of the period of, according to Rebi Yehudah, 210 years; Rebi Yitzchak says: 214 years . . ." (Midrash Neelam, Toldos 140a). (Shaarei Leshem, p. 489). Thus, there is a period of history called "Kibbutz Golios," when the Jewish exiles will finally return to Eretz Yisroel, and that will last forty years. This, in turn, will be followed by Techiyas HaMeisim, which will last anywhere between 210 and 214 years ... Thus, 6000 years less 210 means that Techiyas HaMeisim begins at least by the year 5790, or 2030 CE (according to Rebi Yehudah; according to Rebi Yitzchak, by the year 5786, or 2026 CE). Kibbutz Golios, therefore, would have begun as early as 1986 or as late as 1990, as we have already mentioned. So, [by] 5790, ... Moshiach [will have] already long ago come and finished his work.
http://www.thirtysix.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid= 150

Dec. 12, 2004
Rav Kaduri: Moshiach has Arrived
"After the Sharon government, the Moshiach will come" -- so foresees the Tzaddik, the G-dly Harav Yitzchok Kaduri, shlita. His words were reported in the Israeli newspaper Yediot Achronot. In the words of the Rav, the Moshiach is already in the Holy Land, and will reveal himself in the future at the moment that is set for him. The Rav revealed to his students that according to calculations of the Vilna Gaon, the war of Gog and Magog began about [three] years ago (on Hoshana Raba), and will continue for seven years. During this time, every moment is suited for the Moshiach to reveal himself. (The American War on Terror began on Hoshana Raba when the Americans went into Afghanistan.) Rav Kaduri has lately been speaking with greater frequency on the revelation of the Moshiach, and he said that signs have already been given for this from Heaven by way of cosmic events, which indicate -- according to the secrets of Torah -- the arrival of the benevolent end of days. "The world continues on and is being sweetened" -- thus is the Rav accustomed to addressing his students. The revelation of the Moshiach, according to the Rav, will rescue Jerusalem from the hands of Islam and Xtianity, both of which seek to overwhelm Jerusalem and wrest ownership of her away from the Jewish people; but their ways will not succeed and they will wage war against each other. The Rav revealed that hidden in the garments of Moshiach is a Magen-David which grants him the power to conduct himself in a concealed way. As will be remembered, at the time of the meeting between Rav Kaduri, shlita and the Lubavitcher Rebbe more than 12 years ago, the Rebbe said to him that he would merit to live until the revelation of Moshiach. http://kaduri.net/Index.asp?ArticleI...ryID=69&Page=1
<HTTP: kaduri.net Index.asp?ArticleID="382&CategoryID=69&Page=1">http://www.israelnationalnews.com/news.php3?id=74451

Tuesday 18 Adar II (March 29, 2005)
Kvod Maran Harav Ovadia Yosef, Shlita:
"All the goyim wll be cut down -- they can go to Azazel! All the talk about disengagement from Gush Katif is only temporary. Immediately (tekef umiyad) Moshiach will come!! He is already at our gates! Very shortly he will knock on the door: "I am coming! Ahlan w'sahlan!" Moshiach will come and then -- who are all these dogs (enemies of Israel)? He will throw them to Azazel in the desert! He will return the crown of old, and all of Eretz Yisroel will be ours forever!" Video: http://gog.web-site.co.il/gog/marang3.asx

<HTTP: gog.web-site.co.il gog marang3.asx>

<HTTP: gog.web-site.co.il gog marang3.asx>
<HTTP: gog.web-site.co.il gog marang3.asx>

Thursday 28 Adar II (April 8, 2005)
Rav Beniyahu Shmueli
The Yeshiva of Mekubalim in Jerusalem: B'Nissan nigalu u-b'Nissan asidin l'higael. We anticipate that in Chodesh Nissan the complete redemption will come! In the Yeshiva of the mekubalim "Nahar Shalom" in Jerusalem they are anticipating that the geulah will arrive this year in the month of Nissan. Thus informs the Rosh Yeshiva, Rav Beniyahu Shmueli, shlita, in his weekly drasha broadcast via sattelite and over the internet. The Rav called upon Am Yisroel to strengthen themselves (lehis'chazek) in Torah and Mitzvos in the remaining days before the month of Nissan. Video: http://gog.web-site.co.il/gog/bnayahug.asx Text: http://gog.web-site.co.il

<HTTP: gog.web-site.co.il />


Monday 2 Nissan (April 11, 2005)
HaTzadik, HaChocham, Avraham Chai
An extremely rare public appearence by the tzaddik and chacham Avraham Chai, shlita, was broadcast via sattelite and over the internet. The purpose was to explain to Jews why specifically now the complete redemption will come, despite the fact that it hasn't come in thousands of years, despite the fact that in earlier generations there were many tzaddikim and great and holy Jews. Similarly, he added that this very month of Nissan in the year 5765 is the month of the promised redemption, and he urged Jews to increase their tshuva, reading of tehillim (psalms) and study of Torah, because right now "the time is very valuable." Video: http://gog.web-site.co.il/gog/hahamg.asx
<HTTP: gog.web-site.co.il gog hahamg.asx>

<HTTP: gog.web-site.co.il gog hahamg.asx>
<HTTP: gog.web-site.co.il gog hahamg.asx>

Monday 2 Nissan (April 11, 2005)
Maggid of Binyamin, Dov Bar Leib
5765 = 15th of Nissan on Cosmologic Clock
Everyone, Hold on to your Seat! Hurry my beloved, for the appointed moment has Arrived!!! Pesach of the final REDEMPTION!!
Everyone, it is now time to pray and clean out the leaven. Rav Mordechai Eliyahu has introduced a Tzaddik to the world who has informed us that the Geulah will begin during this Holy month ...

All of world history is a cosmic travel from Pesach to Sukkot (Tabernacles). The first Temple corresponded with Pesach. The Second Temple corresponded with Shavuot (The Feast of Weeks). The final Temple will correspond with Sukkot (Tabernacles). Because of our sin of internecine causeless hatred, the divine presence could not come down into the Second Temple. The 420 years that it stood plus the 70 years that Yerushalayim was barren between the Temples add up to 490 years. There are 49 days between Pesach and Shavuot. Each decade of the Second Temple period corresponded with one level of purity that we purify ourselves during the 49 day period between Pesach and Shavuot. Because of our disunity, the Divine Presence could not descend into the Holy of Holies and reside at the end of 490 years. Therefore the Talmud tells us that the red thread that was tied between the horns of the goat that went to Azezel did not turn white for the last 40 years before the Second Temple was destroyed. On the day of the Second Temples destruction, the 9th of Av, instead of welcoming the Divine Presence's descent into the Second Temple, we entered the year of the 17th of Tamuz. You see, every year for that last 40 years when the sins of the nation were not forgiven on Yom Kippur was like one day between Shavuot and the 17th of Tamuz, the day that the desert generation worshiped the golden calf ...in order to make way for Israel's redemption the Cosmic Clock would need to start ticking. It had been stuck on the 17th of Tamuz since the year 70. The last and 7th Churban (destruction ) would need to correspond with the 9th of Av. There are 21 days between the 17th of Tamuz and the 9th of Av. There are 21 years between the end of WWI in 1918 and the beginning of WW2 in 1939. The Cosmic Clock started to tick again in 1918. The winds of cosmic change were so great that for the first time since the destruction of the Second Temple the majority of the world's Jews were no longer Shomer Shabbat (Sabbath observant). The Chofetz Chaim and other Gedolim were asked why is it that children of Torah Scholars were now Bolshevicks? Does not the apple always fall close to the tree. The Gadol Hador answered,"not when the winds of cosmic change are blowing at gale force." Those winds of cosmic change started blowing with gale force in 1918...

1918 (5678) was the last year of the 17th of Tamuz ... 1931 (5691) was Rosh Chodesh Av (the first of Av)... 1939 (5699) was the 9th of Av. ****** attacked Poland less than one month before the year 5700 which would have corresponded with the tenth of Av ...

5705 (1945) was Tu B'Av, an ancient festival celebrating the end of our destructions which regularly started with the 9th of Av. Here we also have the Vav in Esau's name, the six years of the Holocaust, 40-45.

... Macrocosmic and Microcosmic coexistent processes - Since we are now approaching the Sukkot period of world History, the redemption from 1945 onwards can and must be understood on two levels, the redemption of Israel which is tied most closely with Pesach and the redemption of Mankind which is tied most closely with Sukkot ... 5705 marked the end of WW2 and can best be tied to the 15th of Av, microcosmically for Israel as a nation it was tied mostly with the 15th of Sh'vat, the New Year for tree fruits in the Land of Israel. It was time to come home.

... before the great rebuke in Leviticus, we read about the seven cycles of Shmittah and then the Jubilee year [when] the land and its owners were to be returned to their posessions. Tashuvu L'achuzato , you will return ... The numerical value is 708 ... 5708 was 1948. That year was chai (18th) b'av or chai b'shvat depending on our macrocosmic or microcosmic reference ...


5727 (1967) ... the 7th of Adar/Elul ... Moshe Rabbeinu's day of death. The last place he saw while standing on Mt Nebo across the Jordan was the part of the Land of Israel that was closest to where he was standing, Judea and Samaria. 5734, Fall of 1973 ...14th Adar... the Yom Kippur War, the war which was a day like Purim as our sages would put it.

5750 (1990) and 5751 (1991) correspond with Rosh Hashana and Rosh Chodesh Nissan respectively. Since these are New Years, one would expect that because of these two years the world would change forever. The Vilna Gaon even tells us that. He said that 3/4 of the way through the Sixth Millenium would be like 3/4 of the way through the Sixth day of the week. Since the day begins at sundown, 3/4 through Friday takes us to high noon, when shofar blowers in ancient times ascended the hills of the Land of Israel to blow the shofar to call Israel in from their fields to prepare for Shabbat, the 7th millenium. And a great shofar blast (a Tekiah) was blown in heaven, and in came Jews who got lost in the Land of Ashur, were absorbed by the Turkish tribe called the Khazars, 1200 years later reconverted back to Judaism, and were eventually absorbed by the expanding Russian empire when Khazaria was destroyed in 1243 ce. And in came the castaways that Sencheriv no longer needed as porters in Egypt ... In 5751, on (erev) Shabbat, 14,000 (Ethiopian) Jews came home as they crossed the placid waters of the Sanbat in the greatest airlift of human cargo of all time ... Of course just to let us know that 5751 was Rosh Hashana, and the beginning of the last quarter of the 6th Millenium, 39 scuds fell on the Land of Israel to prepare the nation for the time that will always be Shabbat. ( There are 39 major categories of prohibited activity on the Shabbat.)

At this point we entered the Ten Years of Awe between Rosh Hashana and Yom Kippur (or between Rosh Chodesh Nissan and the tenth of Nissan when we prepared for the redemption from Egypt) ....5760(Y2K) was therefore Yom Kippur/10th of Nissan. At the very end of that year the Al aksa intafada began, for the entire world had been immersed in a kosher mikva since there are 5760 egg volumes of water in a kosher mikvah. From this point onwards the world was being sweetened for judgment. So let me see. There are four intervening days between Yom Kippur/10th of Nissan until Sukkot and Pesach (5761-64). COULD THIS REALLY BE THE YEAR OF SUKKOT/PESACH!!!! Again, MAHER EHOV KI BA MOED! God willing we are not stuck on Yom Kippur like we were on the 17th of Tamuz.
A HAPPY and KOSHER Pesach to all, and to all a ....
http://yearsofawe.blogspot.com/2005/04/everyone-hold-on-to-your-seat.html

Nissan 5 April 13th
(Unconfirmed)
A letter that was received from a hidden TZADIK (righteous) from Jerusalem, that claims that he received a personal message from MESHIAH-TZIDKENU (The Messiah), and asks to publish and distribute this letter on the net (the details are reserved in the management)
And your servant is the first to announce with great joy, with the help of HaShem, that in the low world, "KLIPOS world", down and below, in fifty gates of TUM'AA (impurity), all the roots of all the KLIPOS have been felled, and soon we will see, with the help of HaShem, the GEULA (redemption) that we are anticipating, a final GEULA (redemption) with the Messiah son of David, without any losses to any son-of-Israel wherever he is!!! And in simple words, that arrive with the help of HaShem from a simple man as myself: "In Nissan they were delivered - and in Nissan they will be delivered" - earthquakes, volcanoes' eruptions, land being wiped out, and whole countries being left without remains, and all of this without any son-of-Israel being hurt!!! All this will happen within a few days from publishing this letter, and all of the important enormous events mentioned will last no more than three days! The most important MITZVA (commandment) right now, my brothers and friends, is to be rejoiced with the SIMHA of HaShem, who is delivering us now a final GEULA (redpemption), Amen !!! http://magog.web-site.co.il/gog/e_main.shtml

Last edited by ShleimutHaaretz; 04-14-2005 at 06:30 AM.
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Unread 04-12-2005, 09:26 AM   #21
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ShelimutHaaretz: Much better. But the entire blog article? Maybe a paragraph or two and a link would be more appealing.

Last edited by Yankel Nosson; 04-12-2005 at 09:51 AM.
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Unread 04-12-2005, 09:36 AM   #22
hope2beAbochur
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holy moly, that post by shleimus haaretz is a novel not just a regular post!!
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Unread 04-12-2005, 09:53 AM   #23
Torah613
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Do we really have to be a clearing house for pronouncements of which some at least - are examples of shitos that the Rebbe fought against, namely, the aschalta de'geulah school (AKA the RZ Messianic school)?
No, I will not enter a debate to prove that the Rebbe would hold his shita even today (and wouldn't have changed his mind).

Last edited by Torah613; 04-12-2005 at 09:57 AM.
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Unread 04-12-2005, 04:15 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Torah613
Do we really have to be a clearing house for pronouncements of which some at least - are examples of shitos that the Rebbe fought against, namely, the aschalta de'geulah school (AKA the RZ Messianic school)?
No, I will not enter a debate to prove that the Rebbe would hold his shita even today (and wouldn't have changed his mind).
I thought that the Rebbe's objections in the past were to religious zionists claiming that the State of Israel was the itchalta degeulah - whereas the Meshichists (l'havdil) received nothing but support and encouragement from the Rebbe, [***] in 5751 thru 5754 etc.!

Is there a particular source or sicha that you are referring to with regards to this objection of the Rebbe that you were referring to?
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Unread 04-12-2005, 05:42 PM   #25
Torah613
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1) I don't see where you see that I wrote about the M'n (though that may deserve its own discussion), 2) I don't understand the "l'havdil"..
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