Shtreimel

[yehonasan]

Der Frerdiker Rebbe wore a Spodek, right? Since Chasidim try to follow their Rebbe, why didn't the Rebbe wear a Spodek/Shtreimel?

Also, did the Frerdiker Rebbe's chassidim wear a Shtreimel? Did they then take them off when the Rebbe assumed leadership?

Also, I assume that most chassidim in Russia wore a Shtreimel before WW II. Did the Rebbe's father wear a Shtreimel? If yes, why didn't the Rebbe? THere is an inyan of maintining minhagim of a father -- kibud av.

Please enlighten me on this subject.

[masbir]

Most Lubavitch Chasidim never ever wore a shtreimal, even in Russia before the wars, furthermore the Rebbe reshab wore only a shreimal while in the town of Lubavitch, when he traveled he didnt wear a shtreimal..

The Rebbes father never wore a shtreimal.

A Shtreimal in Chabad (and possible also by othe Russian Chasidim as Korliners, Slonim, and even from Chernoble dynesty) was only for the Rebbe.

The Rebbe acted as if he is just a Chosid of his shver, he didnt assume leaderhip, so he wont wear a shtreimal.

[masbir]

The Fr. Rebbe put on a shtreimel only when in Poland

Nothing to do with Poland, but like his father, he also wore one. (you mean a spodik?)

[pretzel999]

Originally posted by Jude
The Fr. Rebbe put on a shtreimel only when in Poland, to do as the natives did. Russian Chasidim did not wear it.

The FR wore something similar to a spodik, a fur hat which is about twice the height of a shtreimel and narrower, this covering is favoured by Polish dynasties such as Ger, Alexander, Amshinov, Sochatchov, Modzitz

[Jude]

The Rebbe acted as if he is just a Chosid of his shver, he didnt assume leaderhip, so he wont wear a shtreimal.

So from the fact that the Rebbe never put on a shtreimel/spodik we deduce that the Rebbe never accepted the Chabad leadership?

[masbir]

We dont have to deduce, we know he did, but he disliked the outer expressions of it. and he even if he didnt the mere fact we are his Chasdism makes him the Nosi.

[masbir]

We believe the Rebbe makes the shtreimal, unlike others who believe that the shtriemal makes and creates the rebbe. The bigger, nicer, the shtriemal, the bigger the Rebbe.

But dont worry, those that need a shtriemal, there is the Liozner Rebbe Admur Reb shimmi Duetch who wears a spodik. (according Jude, I even belong there)

[pretzel999]

Originally posted by masbir
We dont have to deduce, we know he did, but he disliked the outer expressions of it. and he even if he didnt the mere fact we are his Chasdism makes him the Nosi.

Mas, are you of the opinion that the Rebbe is Nosi Hador, post gimmel T.?

[yehonasan]

So does everyone agree that the FR wore a streimel? When? Every Shabbos? or only when in Poland?

Does everyone agree that Rebbe's father did NOT wear a Streimel?

But if FR wore a streimel, shouldn't the Rebbe have worn one? We wear a fedora b/c the Rebbe did. Correct?

[pretzel999]

We wear a fedora b/c the Rebbe did. Correct

no we don't its an old jewish levush

[masbir]

1)The FR wore a shtreimal shabbos yomtov. and other happy events. He also wore in the the states. There is a famous picture of the FR wearing the Shtriemal when recieving his citiziship papers.

2)The Rebbes father, never wore a shtreimal.


3) a)As I wrote, it was a Rebbishe thing so no one thought of emulating. b)In the olden times Lubavitch never imitated the Rebbes, it was a sign of Chitzonious. c)I think Lubavitch would wear fodoras anyway (they wore fedores even before the Rebbe became Rebbe) d)In our generation the rebbe changed Chabad and encouraged more the emulating the Rebbe, and if the Rebbe would wear a shtreimal, it is likely everyone would wear one.

[masbir]

no we don't its an old jewish levush

How old?

[yehonasan]

Thanks for the answers Masbir.

[pretzel999]

In general lubavitch has followed a more 'westernized' mode of dress, long chasidic style coats were reserved for Rabbis, not laymen, including shabbat.Once the Rebbe opined on the importance of a long cat on shabbat did the chassidim follow suit with the kapoteh/ sirtuk. The hat worn was also in the Western mode, not the round, samet/biber favoured by other chasidim

[yehonasan]

Why? Why adopt the "modern" or "westernized" dress?

[Chabad Friend]

>Why didn't the Rebbe wear a Shtreimel?<

I asked this question to the Rov of a Lubavitch shul a few months ago. He answered that he thought that the real reason is that his mother-in-law wouldn't let him have the FR's shtreimel.

[yehonasan]

From people who are UNfriendly to Chabad, I have heard similar types of statements.

Again my question that I posed previously: Why? Why adopt the "modern" or "westernized" dress?

[Jude]

according to jude I belong there

not quite accurate
since, according to your own classifications, the first three categories did not describe you, the only remaining category was ...
btw - do you wear a streimel or spodik?

The FR wore a shtreimal shabbos yomtov. and other happy events. He also wore in the the states. There is a famous picture of the FR wearing the Shtriemal when recieving his citiziship papers.

re streimel/spodik (two different types of fur hats)
the Fr. Rebbe wore the streimel while in Lubavitch. He switched to a spodik when he moved to Poland, which is what the natives wore, and never went back to wearing a streimel. In fact, there are no pictures of him wearing a streimel, right?

as to why the Rebbe did not wear a streimel, the Real Reason is because as the Rebbe, he did the things he did for Holy, G-dly reasons unknown to us. When you figure out why the Rebbe Maharash did not wear white, although the Tzemach Tzedek wore white, maybe you'll know why the Rebbe did not wear a streimel.

[masbir]

re streimel/spodik (two different types of fur hats)
the Fr. Rebbe wore the streimel while in Lubavitch. He switched to a spodik when he moved to Poland, which is what the natives wore, and never went back to wearing a streimel. In fact, there are no pictures of him wearing a streimel, right?

Sources for you information please?

as to why the Rebbe did not wear a streimel, the Real Reason is because as the Rebbe, he did the things he did for Holy, G-dly reasons unknown to us. When you figure out why the Rebbe Maharash did not wear white, although the Tzemach Tzedek wore white, maybe you'll know why the Rebbe did not wear a streimel

With such answers, we can close down shop.

[yehonasan]

Originally posted by Jude

as to why the Rebbe did not wear a streimel, the Real Reason is because as the Rebbe, he did the things he did for Holy, G-dly reasons unknown to us. When you figure out why the Rebbe Maharash did not wear white, although the Tzemach Tzedek wore white, maybe you'll know why the Rebbe did not wear a streimel.

Good question: why did each Rebbe seem to dress differently than the previous Rebbe?

one might scoff and say -- this is just chitzonyus; however, following the custom of your Rebbe is an important part of being connected to your Rebbe.

[Jude]

source for what exactly, the switch?
why, do you think that the Fr. Rebbe wore a spodik all along?
what sources do you have?

close shop? don't know why you say that
what purpose is there in speculating as to why the Rebbe did or did not do something?
what often (always?) happens when this is done, is that it pulls the Rebbe down to the level of you and me. The suggestion posted above (post #16) illustrates this quite nicely.

the only answer about headgear that doesn't pull the Rebbe down, is that the Rebbe wore an ordinary hat because he is waiting to wear the crown of Melech Ha'Moshiach. Nothing else will do.

[yehonasan]

I understand your position, Jude, but I think my questions about the Shtreimel are fair and being asked in a respectful manner.

[masbir]

the only answer about headgear that doesn't pull the Rebbe down, is that the Rebbe wore an ordinary hat because he is waiting to wear the crown of Melech Ha'Moshiach. Nothing else will do.

Its you answer, or else (so quickly did you top unters nonsense. wow, you are quick.)

[Jude]

the questions about the streimel are fine, until we begin speculating as to the Rebbe's reasons

why is it my answer or else, masbir?
that's a gratuitous insult
my point, which you chose to ignore, is that providing reasons for why the Rebbe does anything is generally foolish at best and arrogant and un-Chasid like at worst, unless it reflects on the Rebbe's greatness, and has some basis in what the Rebbe said.

[poshut]

The Rebbe wearing a crown?

Oy vey, vu zainin mir farfarin un farkrochin in our understanding of "Rebbe" and "Moshiach."