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Unread 03-27-2008, 02:44 PM   #1
Yankel Nosson
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Chess

When Shlomo Hamelech invented chess, I'm sure he didn't call this piece a "bishop". Name:  ChessPiece.png
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In Hebrew, Wikipedia Ivrit is calling it "רץ" (meaning runner). A Russian guy told me that in Russian they call it "elephant".

Are there Yiddish names for the pieces?
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Unread 03-27-2008, 03:26 PM   #2
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A Russian guy told me that in Russian they call it "elephant".
Or "officer".
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Unread 03-27-2008, 03:45 PM   #3
Smirnoff
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Originally Posted by Yankel Nosson View Post
I'm sure he didn't call this piece a "bishop".
בספרים עתיקים ראיתי שבזמן הרמב"ם קראו לא' מהם בשם "כלב". ודו"ק
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Unread 03-27-2008, 06:08 PM   #4
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Quote:
Shlomo Hamelech invented chess
source?
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Unread 03-27-2008, 06:32 PM   #5
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ס' אלף מרגליות עמ' תלג
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Unread 03-28-2008, 08:07 PM   #6
mordechai7215
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From Yiddish Wikipedia:
: 8 סאלדאטן, 1 קעניג, 1 מלכה, 2 טורעמס, 2 לויפערס און צוויי פערדן.
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Unread 03-31-2008, 08:55 AM   #7
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What a cool queston !!!!1
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Unread 03-31-2008, 10:36 AM   #8
Yankel Nosson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordechai7215 View Post
From Yiddish Wikipedia:
: 8 סאלדאטן, 1 קעניג, 1 מלכה, 2 טורעמס, 2 לויפערס און צוויי פערדן.
Thanks. What's the URL?

King, Queen, soldiers, horses, farshtendlich;

לויפערס = runners(?)
טורעמס = ???
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Unread 06-21-2010, 07:49 PM   #9
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I have not looked at Smirnoff's given source, but is there any evidence to suggest that the rules in the times of Shlomo were the same as those of today? There are several chess variants found in India and other countries which most historians believe evolved into the modern game around 1000 years ago (maybe a bit less). The earliest recorded chess game under modern rules probably took place in the 1300s. In some variants, the bishops move differently and have different names.
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Unread 06-22-2010, 05:21 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mordechai7215 View Post
From Yiddish Wikipedia:
: 8 סאלדאטן, 1 קעניג, 1 מלכה, 2 טורעמס, 2 לויפערס און צוויי פערדן.
Hint: The author didn't know how to say Queen in Yiddish.
(on second thought, look at page 7 over here.)
http://ia310821.us.archive.org/3/ite...nybc213567.pdf
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Unread 06-22-2010, 05:27 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by noahidelaws View Post
source?
Of course he invented chess, why else would he invent electricity if not to go on to invent computers to play chess with?
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Unread 06-22-2010, 05:29 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by MahTovChelkeinu View Post
I have not looked at Smirnoff's given source, but is there any evidence to suggest that the rules in the times of Shlomo were the same as those of today? There are several chess variants found in India and other countries which most historians believe evolved into the modern game around 1000 years ago (maybe a bit less). The earliest recorded chess game under modern rules probably took place in the 1300s. In some variants, the bishops move differently and have different names.
How many are found in the Middle East?
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Unread 06-22-2010, 06:11 PM   #13
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How many are found in the Middle East?
Honestly I am not a maven on the subject. The earliest recorded game I found was here, and took place in Valencia. There are several games from Spain in the 1400s and 1500s on that site and the famous Ruy Lopez lived in Spain in the late 1500s. So we know chess was in Europe by that period. I think most historians believe it was brought over to Europe during the Crusades or other European interactions with the East, but possibly not in its final form.

I'm still rather skeptical of the idea that Shlomo Hamelech invented it just based on the amount of time that would have passed from his life until the 1400s with no surviving records. Not one chess piece or similar artifact was found in all the ruins of Israel from that period, or from any other country - yet we have records of so many other popular pass-times.
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Unread 06-22-2010, 09:08 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by MahTovChelkeinu View Post
I'm still rather skeptical of the idea that Shlomo Hamelech invented it...
FYI the Rebbe says quite clearly in the sichos that Shlomo Hamelech invented it.
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Unread 06-22-2010, 09:17 PM   #15
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Where? Is there a footnote?
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Unread 06-23-2010, 08:07 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Yankel Nosson View Post
Thanks. What's the URL?

King, Queen, soldiers, horses, farshtendlich;

לויפערס = runners(?)
טורעמס = ???
טורעמס = towers
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Unread 06-24-2010, 12:52 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Smirnoff View Post
בספרים עתיקים ראיתי שבזמן הרמב"ם קראו לא' מהם בשם "כלב". ודו"ק
It is quite obvious that the 'bisop' is a causal effect of clerical influence throughout the dark-middle ages.
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