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Unread 04-30-2009, 04:18 PM   #1
constantavodah
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Not another Moshiach thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by WE Vaughn View Post
"After his release from imprisonment in Petersburg, Rabbi Schneur Zalman of Liadi passed through the city of Vitebsk, where he was received by the city elders and community leaders. “Tell us, Rebbe,” he was asked, “when will the tribulations of Israel end? When will the redeemer finally come?”

Rabbi Schneur Zalman lowered his eyes to the ground and said softly: “But how can he come? The Moshiach that everyone wants will never come, and the true Moshiach, no one wants….”

When moshiach comes, today, we will have constant revelation of atzmus or ein sof and many other holy revelations.

As Much as I/we want moshiach, I dont want to have atzmus revealed in front of me! Aside for the blatant fact that im too lowly for those giluim, i want to be able to have some gashmius also and i wont be able todo that If atzmus is revealed!
With that said Does anyone here really want moshiach??

There was a Farbrengen years back in 770 btw a few chassidim and they were discussing this idea, one of the eltere chassidim proclaimed that only a Rebbe could realy want moshiach!
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Unread 04-30-2009, 04:22 PM   #2
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WOah! that is so true! I realy do want moshiach and I realy want to see the rebbe (oy) but as far as revealed Atzmus.... Im not ready to give up everything yet....

In a similar yet different vein: I realy want to see the rebbe, but im ashamed that the rebbe will see the true ME, yet I still desire and Wish to see the Rebbe right now. At least i think I do and i hope the desire is an emeser desire
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Unread 04-30-2009, 04:59 PM   #3
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And if I say that I really do want Moshiach, perhaps I'm not really being honest with myself....but if I say that I don't want Moshiach, then I'm lying...so what do you suggest?

By the way, I am Moshiach.
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Unread 04-30-2009, 05:17 PM   #4
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Its a bit of a crass example, but perhaps we are like little children watching a vacuum cleaner. Its fascinating to see, but really scary if it gets too close.

I think that many of us want moshiach in principal (with all the giluim), but we are also scared of it.
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Unread 04-30-2009, 05:29 PM   #5
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An expert diamond merchant teaches you how to appreciate diamonds.
So now you look at a diamond differently. It's still a diamond. But now you appreciate its intrinsic value.

Gashmiyus is gashmiyus. And it will stay gashmiyus. But we will be able to understand how G-d makes a dwelling place in gashmiyus. How He reveals His Essence in the gashmiyus.

What's there to be scared of? The diamond is still a diamond. Gashmiyus is still gashmiyus. But via the gashmiyus, we will be able to see deeper. And we will be able to see it all around us.
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Unread 04-30-2009, 07:48 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MahTovChelkeinu View Post
Its a bit of a crass example, but perhaps we are like little children watching a vacuum cleaner. Its fascinating to see, but really scary if it gets too close.

I think that many of us want moshiach in principal (with all the giluim), but we are also scared of it.
You can also do what I did and teach them that the vacuum cleaner is not scary, but useful...and even fun.

I beg to differ- I think most people want an image of Moshiach that is not reality.
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Unread 04-30-2009, 11:05 PM   #7
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we know very little about what is going to be when Moshiach comes

scary? yes, anything that is unknown is scary,but at the same time we know that it is the purpose of the all creation and is our mission to accomplish

So ,do we want really Moshaich to come?
it depends who do you ask to:
if you ask to your nefesh Habamis ,then ,I am scare, I want gashmius,etc

if you ask my nefesh elokis ;then I want Moshaich NOWWWWW

IOW, first we have to bring our geula protis
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Unread 04-30-2009, 11:56 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chossidnistar View Post
we know very little about what is going to be when Moshiach comes

scary? yes, anything that is unknown is scary,but at the same time we know that it is the purpose of the all creation and is our mission to accomplish

So ,do we want really Moshaich to come?
it depends who do you ask to:
if you ask to your nefesh Habamis ,then ,I am scare, I want gashmius,etc

if you ask my nefesh elokis ;then I want Moshaich NOWWWWW

IOW, first we have to bring our geula protis
YOU is not just nefesh elokis, its a physical guf with a Nefesh Elokis AND A nefesh habihamis.

Its not that its scary, its are we realy ready to give up all gashmius and live a life full of giluim of or ein sof and the like. Lechora we would all say "YES! just send moshuach already" but If you -all the parts of you- think about it for 1 miunte, Does ur answer stay the same or are you wavering?
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Unread 05-01-2009, 12:05 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by constantavodah View Post
YOU is not just nefesh elokis, its a physical guf with a Nefesh Elokis AND A nefesh habihamis.

Its not that its scary, its are we realy ready to give up all gashmius and live a life full of giluim of or ein sof and the like. Lechora we would all say "YES! just send moshuach already" but If you -all the parts of you- think about it for 1 miunte, Does ur answer stay the same or are you wavering?
what is a geula protis?
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Unread 05-01-2009, 05:08 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chossidnistar View Post
scary? yes, anything that is unknown is scary,but at the same time we know that it is the purpose of the all creation and is our mission to accomplish
If you make it more 'known'- ie, learn some, then you won't be so scared.

Quote:
So ,do we want really Moshaich to come?
it depends who do you ask to:
if you ask to your nefesh Habamis ,then ,I am scare, I want gashmius,etc
Depends whose nefesh habahamis.

Quote:
if you ask my nefesh elokis ;then I want Moshaich NOWWWWW
As long as you didn't give it a sleeping pill, ch"v.

Quote:
IOW, first we have to bring our geula protis
When enough people have done this, then we will have the geula klalit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by constantavodah View Post
YOU is not just nefesh elokis, its a physical guf with a Nefesh Elokis AND A nefesh habihamis.
"You" is the guf with the nefashot?! "You" is the nefesh Elokit with its keilim.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chossidnistar View Post
what is a geula protis?
(Kind of like hashgacha pratis? LOL.)

Geula is a shichrur from the meitzarim that prevent us from serving Hashem properly. Geula klalit is a general geula, a general shichrur, of all klal Yisrael together. Geula pratit is when you remove those boundaries from yourself, in a smaller, more specific way than if it would be for everyone at the same time. It affects you more than anyone else, while klalit affects everyone equally (well, for our purposes, we'll call it equally). Also, pratit has to be from your own effort, klalit is more from l'ma'alah.
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Unread 05-01-2009, 10:55 AM   #11
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this is the idea, we have to work in our geula protis to really want Moshiach to come
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Unread 05-01-2009, 11:31 AM   #12
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Quote:
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what is a geula protis?
atem tilaktu achad echad
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Unread 05-02-2009, 01:45 PM   #13
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tilaktu?
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Unread 05-02-2009, 08:39 PM   #14
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Quote:
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tilaktu?
Did I get that wrong? It's from Yeshaya iirc.
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Unread 05-02-2009, 10:05 PM   #15
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I think that most people want moshiach and rly do want moshiach and they cry ad mosai mit an emes! But we arent ready for all the parts of geulah, and maybe, just maybe, this is only a thought so dont attack me, thats why moshiach isnt here yet
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Unread 05-03-2009, 05:47 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by existwhere? View Post
Did I get that wrong? It's from Yeshaya iirc.
I don't know. The question, though, was because I didn't catch the meaning of the word. Can you type it in Hebrew?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chitas=connect View Post
I think that most people want moshiach and rly do want moshiach and they cry ad mosai mit an emes! But we arent ready for all the parts of geulah, and maybe, just maybe, this is only a thought so dont attack me, thats why moshiach isnt here yet
Agreed.
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Unread 05-03-2009, 06:12 AM   #17
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Quote:
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I don't know. The question, though, was because I didn't catch the meaning of the word. Can you type it in Hebrew?
אתם תלקטו אחד אחד?
It's wrong, but something like that.
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Unread 05-03-2009, 12:08 PM   #18
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אתם תלקטו אחד אחד?
It's wrong, but something like that.
Thank you to the person who corrected me via PM. אתם תלוקטו אחד אחד
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Unread 05-03-2009, 12:34 PM   #19
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Okay, thanks. I now understand....
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Unread 05-04-2009, 08:37 PM   #20
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Quote:
most people want moshiach
No.
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Unread 05-04-2009, 09:18 PM   #21
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no?

what do you mean
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Unread 05-05-2009, 01:28 AM   #22
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Meaning, that: "The Moshiach they want is not a realistic Moshiach, and the Moshiach that we will have, they don't want.' (sic- from somewhere)
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Unread 05-05-2009, 09:51 AM   #23
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Meaning, that: "The Moshiach they want is not a realistic Moshiach, and the Moshiach that we will have, they don't want.' (sic- from somewhere)
well ,this goes for everything
marriage, job, money,success,etc
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Unread 05-05-2009, 09:56 AM   #24
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What do you mean?
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Unread 05-05-2009, 10:16 AM   #25
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some ppl are very demanding, many dreamers

they want to have thousands of ppl in your chabad, they have a minyan of "neshamos"
they want a billion dollars, they have a million
they want a smiley and happy wife all the time, things are different
they want a Moshaich that will give you everything good in life in gashmius and ruchnius in olam aze, with cars,trips, houses, learning, no problems, no illness,etc, and Moshiach is going to be very demanding
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