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Unread 06-07-2005, 03:10 PM   #1
l'il chassidka
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The purpose of a farbrengen

Can someone please tell me the reason why you're supposed to go to all these farbrengens? It's not like when I come home anything's different.

Last edited by l'il chassidka; 06-07-2005 at 03:35 PM.
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Unread 06-07-2005, 03:33 PM   #2
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l'il chassidka, if ur not changing from the farbrengens, it doesn't mean they're worthless, it just means that you need to be working a little harder.
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Unread 06-08-2005, 02:07 AM   #3
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through a farbrengen, the Frierdiker Rebbe says, we become "a tefach hecher." Anyone know the source?
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Unread 06-15-2005, 01:25 AM   #4
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i think though u might not feel inspired now, u might later on in life remember s/t u once heard at a farby yrs ago....
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Unread 06-15-2005, 01:34 AM   #5
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You need to go to a Farby with the right mind set, if you're looking to grow, you'll grow.
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Unread 06-15-2005, 04:42 AM   #6
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There's a famous 'letter from heaven' (?) where it says that a chassidishe farbrengen can accomplish what the Arch Angel of Israel 'Michael' cannot accomplish.
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Unread 06-15-2005, 02:06 PM   #7
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On the wine bottles!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11
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Unread 06-15-2005, 02:44 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deepthinkers
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On the wine bottles!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11
Moshiach Now!
1. Enough with the exclamation marks- you don't need a million per post!
2. How does your comment connect- please explain yourself.
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Unread 06-15-2005, 03:56 PM   #9
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The quote about Malach Michoel is on the (!!!!!) Farbrengen wine bottles(!!!!!).

The connection is always there... you just have to reveal it.
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Unread 06-16-2005, 02:07 AM   #10
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Is it true that this insight came from a 'letter from Heaven'?
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Unread 06-16-2005, 05:05 AM   #11
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http://beismoshiach.org/Misc/Encyclo...lopedia311.htm quoting Igros Kodesh of the Rebbe Rayatz.
Quote:
Among Chassidim there is a well-known saying: "What a farbrengen can achieve, even the Angel Michoel cannot achieve." The Angel Michoel is responsible for bestowing the Jewish people with blessings of children, health, and wealth. However, the blessing of Chassidim at a farbrengen is even more powerful.

This saying traces its roots back to the following story:

After the Mezritcher Maggid passed away, the Alter Rebbe became a Chassid of R’ Menachem Mendel of Horodok. On one occasion, the disciples of R’ Menachem Mendel were sitting in Horodok farbrenging, and the Alter Rebbe was present. After speaking words of Torah, they began discussing various holy matters, while drinking spirits. In the middle of the farbrengen, one of the Chassidim stood up – an individual who, lo aleinu, suffered a great deal from bad health, and the doctors could not help him. He began to cry, requesting the other Chassidim to bless him with a complete recovery.

One of the Chassidim began to jest, "As if we have the power to give such blessings! How could you suggest such a stupid thing?" Others complained that he was placing too much faith in simple people, for blessings can only be given by individuals of unique stature, the righteous of the generation.

But this did not quiet the Chassid. He continued to beg the Chassidim to bless him, pleading from the heart with tears flowing from his eyes. Seeing this, the Chassidim started to sing a niggun, hoping that would calm him down.

"Quiet!" shouted the Alter Rebbe, stopping the niggun abruptly. Even the crying Chassid stopped sobbing.

"Brothers and friends," announced the Alter Rebbe, "have you forgotten the teaching that the decrees of holy angels can be annulled by the students of our holy Rebbe? Dos vos es ken oiftaun a Chassidishe farbrengen ken malach Michoel nit oiftaun (What a Chassidic farbrengen can accomplish cannot even be accomplished by the Angel Michoel)."

When all those present remembered the teaching, they became inflamed with the fire of brotherly love, and they blessed their brother, the Chassid, with a complete recovery.

On that occasion, the Alter Rebbe explained the concept with an analogy: Children are naturally possessive of their own possessions, and they defend their own property from other children, in a display of bad character traits. They do not care about others and worry only about their own possessions. This is a source of distress to their father. Therefore, the father hires an educator to train the children with good traits. After a period of time, the father watches the children again and sees them caring for each other, which gives him tremendous pleasure. Now he is much more likely to grant any requests that the children may have. (ibid., pp. 412-3)
I dont see anything about a 'letter from heaven'.
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Unread 06-16-2005, 10:12 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Majorthinker
l'il chassidka, if ur not changing from the farbrengens, it doesn't mean they're worthless, it just means that you need to be working a little harder.
Wrong.

Either it's already working, it doesn't work at all, or it doesn't work for her. Unless...

Quote:
Originally Posted by n'eNow770
You need to go to a Farby with the right mind set, if you're looking to grow, you'll grow.
But maybe that's what you meant to begin with.
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Unread 06-16-2005, 01:49 PM   #13
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You have to first make yourself into a keli, be ready to internalize wtvr you learn at a farby then it works!!!!!!!!!
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Unread 06-16-2005, 02:22 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Eigth King
http://beismoshiach.org/Misc/Encyclo...lopedia311.htm quoting Igros Kodesh of the Rebbe Rayatz.
I dont see anything about a 'letter from heaven'.
The original language is as follows:
ויאמר רבינו הזקן: אחי ורעי האם שכחתם אותה הפתקא אשר משמי שמיא נחיתא בטל אורות בגזרת עירין קדישין בסוד החבריא קדישא תלמידי רבינו הקדוש: דאס וואס עס קען אויפטאן א חסידידשער פארבריינגען קען מלאך מיכאל ניט אויפטאן.
(printed in the letters printed in back of the tehillim p. 199).
I will leave for someone else to decide whether the translation posted by "The Eighth King" ["Brothers and friends," announced the Alter Rebbe, "have you forgotten the teaching that the decrees of holy angels can be annulled by the students of our holy Rebbe? Dos vos es ken oiftaun a Chassidishe farbrengen ken malach Michoel nit oiftaun (What a Chassidic farbrengen can accomplish cannot even be accomplished by the Angel Michoel)."]
is accurate or not.

Last edited by Torah613; 06-16-2005 at 02:26 PM.
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Unread 06-16-2005, 03:25 PM   #15
The Eighth King
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Oh... wow. Thank you very much for the correction. There is certainly a difference between the original text, and this translation which leaves out the words "הפתקא משמי שמיא נחיתא". I unfortunately don't have an Igros of the Rebbe Rayatz handy (so I didn't look it up in the original text), and I didn't realize that this is printed in the back of Tehillim. Just goes to show you...

Last edited by The Eighth King; 06-17-2005 at 01:00 AM.
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Unread 06-16-2005, 04:07 PM   #16
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This is how it is translated in the back of the new English Tehillims from Kehos:
Quote:
"My brothers and colleagues, have you forgotten the hallowed declaration, 'what a Chassidic Farbrengen can accomplish even the angel Micha'el cannot achieve?'"
It appears that they left out half the sentence... Just goes to show you...
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Unread 06-16-2005, 05:51 PM   #17
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Just thought i'd bring in a Litvish viewpoint on this.
Someone once asked R' Yisroel Salanter what should they do if they're learning (should i say it?!) MUSSAR (oh no the forbidden word!!!) but not seeing any change in themselves etc...He responded by saying that even if you don't see a change, it's internal and you are growing from it and it is influencing you.
I think that we as Chassidim can apply this to the concept of a Farby and other things... even if we don't realize it, by putting ourselves in the right environment, it IS changing us!
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Unread 06-17-2005, 12:22 AM   #18
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Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torah613
The original language is as follows:
ויאמר רבינו הזקן: אחי ורעי האם שכחתם אותה הפתקא אשר משמי שמיא נחיתא בטל אורות בגזרת עירין קדישין בסוד החבריא קדישא תלמידי רבינו הקדוש: דאס וואס עס קען אויפטאן א חסידידשער פארבריינגען קען מלאך מיכאל ניט אויפטאן.
(printed in the letters printed in back of the tehillim p. 199).
I will leave for someone else to decide whether the translation posted by "The Eighth King" ["Brothers and friends," announced the Alter Rebbe, "have you forgotten the teaching that the decrees of holy angels can be annulled by the students of our holy Rebbe? Dos vos es ken oiftaun a Chassidishe farbrengen ken malach Michoel nit oiftaun (What a Chassidic farbrengen can accomplish cannot even be accomplished by the Angel Michoel)."]
is accurate or not.
Yashar Koach, T613, this was the quote that I had come accross.
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Unread 06-17-2005, 02:32 AM   #19
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But wait a minute, if everyone translates it without the letter, maybe it's just a reference to something else.

Eighth King: "just goes to show you" that what? People don't understand Aramaic?
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Unread 06-17-2005, 02:58 AM   #20
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...to always check the original text... Things get lost in translation, quite literally.
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Unread 06-17-2005, 07:18 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LavDavka
But wait a minute, if everyone translates it without the letter, maybe it's just a reference to something else.

Eighth King: "just goes to show you" that what? People don't understand Aramaic?
Maybe, probably not.
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Unread 06-17-2005, 10:35 AM   #22
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Interesting. That whole description in the original is replaced in translation with three dots...
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Unread 06-19-2005, 12:55 AM   #23
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So the bottom line seems to be that a farbrengen is a gevaltike zach.
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Unread 06-21-2005, 12:35 PM   #24
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What if I want to grow, and I'm trying to, but it's not exactly working?
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Unread 06-21-2005, 12:53 PM   #25
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You mean it doesn't seem to be working.
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