Jewish Forum & Discussions - Chabad Talk  

Go Back   Jewish Forum & Discussions - Chabad Talk > Torah and Judaism > Halachah & Minhagim

Reply
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 4 votes, 5.00 average. Display Modes
Unread 02-23-2011, 05:22 PM   #1
FlyingAxe
Silver Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 607
Tying up the beard

Does anyone know if the Rebbe has ever said anything for the general case (for all chassidim) regarding tying up one's beard?

On the one hand, the Rebbe himself tied up his beard before the nesius and even some time at the beginning. Plus, I've heard a story from Rabbi Paltiel about the Rebbe telling someone — who said that he was having professional problems because of wearing a full, untrimmed beard — to tie it up (but, this may be a specific case). Plus, there is an idea that chassidim must look menchlach and not offend other people (at the same time, not be afraid to look like yidden). So, for someone who works in a professional environment, where he is trying to do kiddush Hashem, and whose beard looks like an explosion on pasta factory when untied, it would seem a good idea to tie it up.

On the other hand, I have heard that the grandfather of my mashpia was against people publishing the pictures of the Rebbe before nesius, because that could lead (and did lead) to some people thinking that the Rebbe trimmed. (And I myself, after I started tying up my beard, got surprised reaction from the people who thought that I trimmed.)

I know: ask mashpia. I am wondering, however, what different people think or what their mashpi'im told them...
FlyingAxe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-23-2011, 07:20 PM   #2
Torah613
ChabadTalk.com Elder!
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 11,716
What exactly is the question?
Torah613 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-23-2011, 08:10 PM   #3
FlyingAxe
Silver Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 607
1. Is there a horo’oh of the Rebbe regarding tying up the beard?
2. If there is not, what do people think regarding this practice?
FlyingAxe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-24-2011, 01:24 AM   #4
noahidelaws
Executive Platinum Member
 
noahidelaws's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,479
There's a line about it in Toras Sholom, no?
noahidelaws is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-24-2011, 08:06 PM   #5
Wolfson
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 36
Tying (Rolling) Up the Beard

This matter is discussed in sefer Hadras Ponim Zokon 2:12 at length, quoting from the Ben Ish Chai in Teshuvos Torah Lishma (#447), the Rebbe Rashab in Toras Sholom (pg. 74, where he refers to this practice as a "misnaged l'Elokus"), the Rebbe Rashab quoted by Rabbi Jacobson in Zikaron L'vnei Yisroel pg. 36 and the Rebbe in Purim 5711 (Toras Menachem Purim 5711 pg. 325).

Following is an additional source which is quoted in the (more recent) "The Beard in Jewish Law" (KTAV, 2010), pg. 59 footnote 2:
"The Ben Ish Chai held the beard so dear that he even counseled against rolling it or folding it to make it appear shorter than it actually is, as he writes: 'There are people whom G d created with a long beard and they attempt different clever methods to change this good gift which they were granted by G d. They seek to make their beards appear short by lifting up the hairs. Although they are careful not to cut them, heaven forbid. Nevertheless, they are not acting properly. Instead, they should leave it as is and rejoice in their portion' (R. Yosef Chayim in his text, Torah Lishmah, sec. 447. See a similar comment in the text Meor Yisrael (the biography of the Baba Sali), p. 90, which quotes him as saying: 'It is not appropriate that something intended to be a person’s glory should be a source of embarrassment.' He instructed the person not to continue folding his beard. See also Sefer Hadras Panim Zokon, sec. II, ch. 12, addendum 1, which addresses this subject)".
Wolfson is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-24-2011, 08:22 PM   #6
FlyingAxe
Silver Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 607
So, how is this reconciled with the fact that the Rebbe folded his beard before and during the first years of nesius?
FlyingAxe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-28-2011, 01:36 PM   #7
chossidnistar
Senior Diamond Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,699
Most problably the Rebbe did not have these kavannos when folding his beard.Maybe it was a way to mekarev more ppl.
chossidnistar is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-28-2011, 03:09 PM   #8
Shmully
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 138
I believe that the Rebbe writes in a letter (in Iggros Kodesh) that rolling the beard under is acceptable, except for select people (I am sorry; I do not have it near to hand to quote the exact reference; IIRC the expression was Yechiday Segulah, or similar)
Shmully is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-28-2011, 03:10 PM   #9
Torah613
ChabadTalk.com Elder!
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 11,716
Quote:
Originally Posted by chossidnistar View Post
Maybe it was a way to mekarev more ppl.
?????
Torah613 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-28-2011, 05:17 PM   #10
chossidnistar
Senior Diamond Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,699
just gessing posibilities,who knows
chossidnistar is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-28-2011, 07:40 PM   #11
Wolfson
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 36
Source in Igros Kodesh regarding Tying (Rolling) Up the Beard

Shmully writes: "I believe that the Rebbe writes in a letter (in Iggros Kodesh) that rolling the beard under is acceptable, except for select people (I am sorry; I do not have it near to hand to quote the exact reference; IIRC the expression was Yechiday Segulah, or similar)"

The letter Shmully is recalling is probably the letter printed in Likutei Sichos XII (hosafos to parshas Kedoshim) which does not discuss rolling the beard, but rather regarding combing the beard. The letter is written to a bochur who was being encouraged by his mother to "straighten" his beard out of concern for his success in shidduchim. The Rebbe responded that it depends on what is meant by "straighten." If "straighten" refers to cutting the beard to make it even, it should not be done, since the Tzemach Tzedek rules that cutting the beard even just to make the hairs even would transgress (not a "minhag tov") but a halachic requirement ("chiuv"). If, however, "straighten" refers to brushing/combing the beard to make it straight/even, that would be acceptable (and will placate his mother), since it is only "yechidei segula" who are scrupulous to not comb their beard [the Rebbe wrote in the Reshimos that the Rebbe Rashab did not comb his beard]. The Rebbe concludes that the concern that a full beard will impact negatively on shidduchim is absurd, since it is universally accepted that the beard is the channel and conduit for blessings from Above. [For a comprehensive treatment of the issue of combing/brushing the beard, see sefer Hadras Ponim Zokon II:12].
Wolfson is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Beard rebyoel Halachah & Minhagim 155 11-26-2009 05:21 PM
tying knots on shabbos hope2beAbochur Halachah & Minhagim 0 05-18-2005 08:03 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:02 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
2001 - 2016 ChabadTalk.com