Jewish Forum & Discussions - Chabad Talk  

Go Back   Jewish Forum & Discussions - Chabad Talk > Torah and Judaism > Yiddishkeit > Noahide - Bnei Noach

Reply
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Unread 11-10-2010, 06:32 PM   #1
mosheh5769
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,429
Hilchos Yichud for non-Jews

I use to study with a non-Jew very interrested in keeping with a complete emunah the Sheva Brachos, and he is affiliated with our Shul. Is it fair to study the laws of Yichud with him and do they apply also to non-Jews?

There are many other thinks some of us would like ti study with him but sometimes we're in doubt if we should study such and such with him or not, and even the Rabbis here sometimes don't really have an answer because they're not used to deal with non-Jews interrested in Torah and Avodas Hashem for Bnei Noach.

What do you think and what are other areas of Halocho we can explore with a non-Jew?
__________________
כל ישראל יש להם חלק לעולם הבא
mosheh5769 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-10-2010, 09:03 PM   #2
Torah613
ChabadTalk.com Elder!
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 11,716
These days there are good seforim on the market on these topics.
Torah613 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-10-2010, 09:05 PM   #3
mosheh5769
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,429
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torah613 View Post
These days there are good seforim on the market on these topics.
Do you have some suggestion, please?
__________________
כל ישראל יש להם חלק לעולם הבא
mosheh5769 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-11-2010, 11:11 AM   #4
MahTovChelkeinu
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,142
https://store.kehotonline.com/index....temsperpage=10

I have no opinion about the book as I have not read through it, but it seems pretty available in stores even though kehot is sold out.

Artscroll does not appear to have anything in English that is exclusively about yichud, but I'm sure there are chapters in tznius books and the like.
MahTovChelkeinu is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-11-2010, 12:44 PM   #5
Meshulam
Senior Diamond Member
 
Meshulam's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,427
There is a book by R' Dovid Ribiat (he wrote the excellent "39 Melachos" book) called "The Halachos of Yichud." It is excellent.
Meshulam is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-11-2010, 02:40 PM   #6
mosheh5769
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,429
Thank you. I've heard good things about both books you brought. Many said it may be useful to use them with Jews and non-Jews alike. I'll try to order both books to read them by my own and then we'll teach the most relevant parts.
__________________
כל ישראל יש להם חלק לעולם הבא
mosheh5769 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-11-2010, 02:55 PM   #7
Torah613
ChabadTalk.com Elder!
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 11,716
Yichud applies to non-Jews? Is that something discussed in that book?
Why would Shabbas be relevant to a non-Jew?
Torah613 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-11-2010, 03:16 PM   #8
mosheh5769
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,429
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torah613 View Post
Yichud applies to non-Jews? Is that something discussed in that book?
Why would Shabbas be relevant to a non-Jew?
"Many said it may be useful to use them with Jews and non-Jews alike" does not mean that it applies to non-Jews. It doesn't apply to them, but when you are obliged to work with them, you should know those laws and their application, and it may be a good idea to share with them some of those rules to avoid some misunderstanding.
__________________
כל ישראל יש להם חלק לעולם הבא
mosheh5769 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-11-2010, 03:25 PM   #9
mosheh5769
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,429
My question was a double one:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mosheh5769 View Post
Is it fair to study the laws of Yichud with him and do they apply also to non-Jews?
1) to study with that guy in our shul? (the rabbis don't know)
2) do they apply also to non-Jews? (the answer was no, but because now some of us are obliged to work with non-jewish females, they said that it may be a good idea to explain them some fondamental rules of the prohibition of yichud to avoid some situation and misunderstanding)
__________________
כל ישראל יש להם חלק לעולם הבא
mosheh5769 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-11-2010, 06:04 PM   #10
Torah613
ChabadTalk.com Elder!
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 11,716
So be clear: Your question was whether to teach them the laws of yichud that apply to a Jew being misyached with a non-Jew.
In your original post you asked if they "apply to a non-Jew".

And the connection to Shabbos is...?
Torah613 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2010, 12:31 AM   #11
noahidelaws
Executive Platinum Member
 
noahidelaws's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,479
Attached is a translation of two sichos in which the Rebbe explains how "rational Mitzvos" are relevant to non-Jews. I have also attached a sicha that explains that non-Jews need to struggle with their yetzer hara even more than Jews. As far as your question, I deduce from this that the principle of yichud does apply for non-Jews, but I leave you to draw your own conclusions.
Attached Files
File Type: doc Lesson from Nozir.doc (67.0 KB, 185 views)
noahidelaws is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2010, 01:03 AM   #12
Torah613
ChabadTalk.com Elder!
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 11,716
Including derabbonons?
Torah613 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2010, 05:12 AM   #13
mosheh5769
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,429
Quote:
Originally Posted by noahidelaws View Post
Attached is a translation of two sichos in which the Rebbe explains how "rational Mitzvos" are relevant to non-Jews. I have also attached a sicha that explains that non-Jews need to struggle with their yetzer hara even more than Jews. As far as your question, I deduce from this that the principle of yichud does apply for non-Jews, but I leave you to draw your own conclusions.
Thank you Noach. Very interresting and I learned a lot. I have only one question: how is it that most of the rabbis don't reach to non-Jews in the way described in those sichos? I'm quite certain that it may quickly contribute to make our world a dira b'tachtonim.
__________________
כל ישראל יש להם חלק לעולם הבא
mosheh5769 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2010, 07:21 AM   #14
mosheh5769
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,429
Rashi says (on Bereshis 34:7):

וכן לא יעשה: לענות את הבתולות, שהאומות גדרו עצמן מן העריות על ידי המבול

If the Bnei Noach, because of the mabul, took upon themselves to avoid עריות,is it not fair to assume that indeed the laws of yichud can also apply to non-Jews?
__________________
כל ישראל יש להם חלק לעולם הבא
mosheh5769 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2010, 08:49 AM   #15
Torah613
ChabadTalk.com Elder!
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 11,716
I see no reason why that should apply to derabonons.
וראה בס' מצות השם קצת שקו"ט בזה. ואכ"מ
Torah613 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2010, 01:42 PM   #16
noahidelaws
Executive Platinum Member
 
noahidelaws's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,479
Even when it comes to derabonons of yichud, it is certainly a very worthy practice for a non-Jew to be careful in it, especially since halocho itself says that most non-Jews are ... not so trustworthy in these things; i.e., the concept of yichud is even more strict with them. Veday la'meivin.
noahidelaws is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2010, 01:42 PM   #17
Torah613
ChabadTalk.com Elder!
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 11,716
So that is your psak. I hear.
Torah613 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-12-2010, 01:56 PM   #18
noahidelaws
Executive Platinum Member
 
noahidelaws's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,479
Quote:
Originally Posted by mosheh5769 View Post
Thank you Noach. Very interresting and I learned a lot. I have only one question: how is it that most of the rabbis don't reach to non-Jews in the way described in those sichos? I'm quite certain that it may quickly contribute to make our world a dira b'tachtonim.
Their actions are wrong. I have attached two sichos in which the Rebbe addresses the possible explanation for the appalling neglect of Jews to teach the Noahide laws. The sichos after that discuss related topics, including the Rebbe's call for shluchim to be involved with teaching non-Jews.
Attached Files
File Type: doc neglect of 7M.doc (65.5 KB, 188 views)
noahidelaws is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-15-2010, 08:49 AM   #19
ktonton
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 684
two points:

[removed for proprieties sake]

What is more interesting is the question of whether or not we would apply yichud with men to non-jews. (the reason it being permitted to jews not applying at all to non-jews.)
__________________
I can't figure out which I love more, Sha"ch or Ta"z!

Last edited by ktonton; 11-15-2010 at 08:50 AM. Reason: propriety
ktonton is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Men and Tznius - Yichud Jude Modesty - Tznius 43 08-25-2010 03:04 PM
Yichud Shem Havaye/ Elokim magdiel Chassidus 14 06-13-2006 05:21 PM
LeShem Yichud: before Baruch Shi'Amar blackandwhite Lubavitch Minhagim 2 09-18-2005 12:29 PM
yichud with family n'eNow Modesty - Tznius 6 04-19-2005 11:45 PM
Silver Spoon / Yichud room Gevurah Lubavitch Minhagim 28 11-08-2002 12:00 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:05 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
2001 - 2016 ChabadTalk.com