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Unread 05-07-2006, 11:00 PM   #26
magdiel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DW Duke
Yes, eventually he will have to be in the public eye to fulfill his obligations. Any of the Rebbes, or a male member of their families, descended from the Maharal could be a candidate as could the descendants of the exhilarchs etc.
But at any given time there must be someone who is ready to be M if the call from above comes.
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Unread 05-07-2006, 11:03 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magdiel
DWD, he has three strikes already; 1. attorney;2. He cursed a Jew; 3. He is a member of the Sanhedrin; I think that would disqualify him.
I don't want to say anything against him but I thought of David and King Saul when he placed a curse on Sharon. Remember David executed a man for raising his hand against G-d anointed (Saul). I don't know of any prohibition on a member of the Sanhedrin though I do believe Moshiach will probably be an attorney. Remember he will be a great statesmen who will lead the world in political matters so he will have to be knowledgeable about these things. I do think that Yosef probably has too many people who despise him to fit the description of Moshiach.
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Unread 05-07-2006, 11:03 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magdiel
But at any given time there must be someone who is ready to be M if the call from above comes.
Yes, that is true. One thing we haven't mentioned is that I believe he will be a true prophet.
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Unread 05-07-2006, 11:08 PM   #29
magdiel
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Originally Posted by DW Duke
Yes, that is true. One thing we haven't mentioned is that I believe he will be a true prophet.
DWD, don't hold back, give us the other candidates, please
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Unread 05-07-2006, 11:16 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by why
Whats with you and R' Shemtov??? (Is he even a Dovid descendant?)
Why do you think he'd be worthy???! Or are you joking?
Only Lubavitcher who qualifies

Rabbi Avraham Ytzchak Shemtov is descendant from Dovid HaMelech,has a very special and unique relationship with the REBBE,qualifies the criterium of the Rambam in many things : Talmid chochom involved in Torah (nigle and chassidus), with Machne Ysroel and American Friends , he brought thousands of influencial ppl to the REBBE (close to Yddishkait),these ppl that they had Yechidus with the Rebbe like twice a year, they support the main shluchim , giving them the possibility to bring more ydden to Yddishkait.IOW Rabbi A Shemtov was the main shaliach for the Rebbe's success bringing Ydden to Yddishkait and also is the one who underestood better the maimorim(YES, better than R Yoel Kahn)The lsit goes on and on

BUT AS I SAY My candidate is the REBBE, I do not have proofs, but is my candidate
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Unread 05-07-2006, 11:28 PM   #31
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I have read that Rabbi Brody is believed to be a patrilineal descendant of King David but I have not seen the lineage.
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Unread 05-08-2006, 08:36 AM   #32
Torah613
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Based on magdiels assertion lately that Moshiach doesn't have to be ben achar ben, I believe most of us can qualify, as most of us can find yichus to the Maharal, or others known to be from beis Dovid. Therefore levi'im could possibly qualify...
Though the whole premise of this thread is strange - why must I have a candidate? Are we holding elections?
For Rebbe's descended from beis Dovid, you can add the present Satmar Rebbe's .
Why the lechaims? Such a post deserves lechaims...
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Unread 05-08-2006, 10:28 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magdiel
DWD, he has three strikes already; 1. attorney;2. He cursed a Jew; 3. He is a member of the Sanhedrin; I think that would disqualify him.
The Rebbe Hakodem is said to have ordered chassidim to execute several ivsechtzia Jews who infiltrated chabad and thereby endangered the lives of chabadnikim.

R' Dahan only asked H' take Rabin and Sharon, together with the dangers they posed to the Jewish people, out of this world.

[Besides the fact that Sharon's mother was not able to get registered with the misrad hapanim as Jewess and the fact that Sharon was implicated in the deaths of his 1st wife and son, meaning that, if Sharon was Jewish, then, like "altalena" Rabin, mida k'neged mida - Jew killers killed by Jews].

Anyway, does anyone know if R' Dovid Abuchadsera (grandson of the baba sali whom my local shliach called the biggest tzaddik alive today) is from beit dovid? He's m'chazek hundreds of Jews a day when he sees people, including many non-observant sephardim.

What about R' Amnom? He may now have over 100,000 non-observant Jews who became shomer shabbat through him. Did any of Dovid's descendant's head to Teiman?

And for those who think the Rebbe's erred in LS 35:206, what about R' Nachman - was he from the Maharal?

The Amshinover Rebbe (who keeps shabbat till Tuesday to extend the respite of those in gehinnom)?

Rav Lior of Kiryat Arba (the chocham who could have been chief rabbi if he supported land concessions)?

Yosef Yitzchak Ginsburg & Adin Steinsaltz from our troops?

Yoel Schwartz (the Rosh Yeshiva who's almost singlehandedly carrying out the 7M campaign)?

Rav Dahan (the Ramat Gan mekubal who predicted the tsunami)?
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Unread 05-08-2006, 10:39 AM   #34
AkivaYitzhak
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Frumkite, Sharon's mother couldn't get registered? I have never heard there was any question about this.

And Rabbi Nachman was from Beis Dovid. I don't remember if it's through the Maharal. I have his family tree somehwere which came with one of the Breslov Research Institute books. It also shows his relationship to the Alter Rebbe.
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Unread 05-08-2006, 03:02 PM   #35
magdiel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frumkite
The Rebbe Hakodem is said to have ordered chassidim to execute several ivsechtzia Jews who infiltrated chabad and thereby endangered the lives of chabadnikim.

R' Dahan only asked H' take Rabin and Sharon, together with the dangers they posed to the Jewish people, out of this world.

[Besides the fact that Sharon's mother was not able to get registered with the misrad hapanim as Jewess and the fact that Sharon was implicated in the deaths of his 1st wife and son, meaning that, if Sharon was Jewish, then, like "altalena" Rabin, mida k'neged mida - Jew killers killed by Jews].

Anyway, does anyone know if R' Dovid Abuchadsera (grandson of the baba sali whom my local shliach called the biggest tzaddik alive today) is from beit dovid? He's m'chazek hundreds of Jews a day when he sees people, including many non-observant sephardim.

What about R' Amnom? He may now have over 100,000 non-observant Jews who became shomer shabbat through him. Did any of Dovid's descendant's head to Teiman?

And for those who think the Rebbe's erred in LS 35:206, what about R' Nachman - was he from the Maharal?

The Amshinover Rebbe (who keeps shabbat till Tuesday to extend the respite of those in gehinnom)?

Rav Lior of Kiryat Arba (the chocham who could have been chief rabbi if he supported land concessions)?

Yosef Yitzchak Ginsburg & Adin Steinsaltz from our troops?

Yoel Schwartz (the Rosh Yeshiva who's almost singlehandedly carrying out the 7M campaign)?

Rav Dahan (the Ramat Gan mekubal who predicted the tsunami)?
Such a long post could take up a long response, but IMNHO there is a serious factual error.
The rumor about Sharon's mother is an urban legend. Yediot had a detailed magazine article about Sharon's parents and the small yishuv they settled in.Nothing about your allegation. Also, there is a Sharon nephew from Israel, a Lubavitcher(Moshchist also) who told me its bogus.
The claim that Sharon was Implicated in his son's and wife's death is without any basis. The son shot himself by accident, and The Rebbe reached out to Sharon; The wife had a car accident that had nothing to do with Sharon;in fact, he was inconsolable for a long time.
I don't believe it was the Rebbe's way to favor curses;The story about the PR, if true, is clearly distinghishable.Why not try a Brocho? that Sharon will have a refuah shelemo, will wake up and confirm Torah is emes and the Rebbe is Moshiach.
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Unread 05-08-2006, 03:07 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Torah613
Based on magdiels assertion lately that Moshiach doesn't have to be ben achar ben, I believe most of us can qualify, as most of us can find yichus to the Maharal, or others known to be from beis Dovid. Therefore levi'im could possibly qualify...
Though the whole premise of this thread is strange - why must I have a candidate? Are we holding elections?
For Rebbe's descended from beis Dovid, you can add the present Satmar Rebbe's .
Why the lechaims? Such a post deserves lechaims...
Correction; i never asserted that M does not have to be Ben achar Ben; I merely questioned the Torah sources put forward that did not back this up. Since then I asked someone I respect, a Satmar?breslover Talmud Chacham, and he is of the opinion that Ramabm Hilchos Melochim about regular jewish Kings(Perek Daled,i think) does apply.
BTW, r u Shemtov or related?Do you also have him on your short list?
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Unread 05-08-2006, 04:10 PM   #37
Frumkite
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magdiel
Such a long post could take up a long response, but IMNHO there is a serious factual error.
The rumor about Sharon's mother is an urban legend. Yediot had a detailed magazine article about Sharon's parents and the small yishuv they settled in.Nothing about your allegation. Also, there is a Sharon nephew from Israel, a Lubavitcher(Moshchist also) who told me its bogus.
The claim that Sharon was Implicated in his son's and wife's death is without any basis. The son shot himself by accident, and The Rebbe reached out to Sharon; The wife had a car accident that had nothing to do with Sharon;in fact, he was inconsolable for a long time.
I don't believe it was the Rebbe's way to favor curses;The story about the PR, if true, is clearly distinghishable.Why not try a Brocho? that Sharon will have a refuah shelemo, will wake up and confirm Torah is emes and the Rebbe is Moshiach.
Even if Yediot denied a fact it would be far from a source, but Yediot not mentioning a fact means that it must not be true?

Again, only Sharon's father was registered with the misrad ha'panim.

Sharon wrote that his parents were ostracized in the town they moved to (because of intermarriage, perhaps).

Sharon was inconsolable? Sharon was in the middle of an affair with his wife's sister and married that sister soon after the strange car accident.

The first sister's son was found shot to death with Sharon's gun soon after complaining about the whole situation. After an investigation of Sharon, it was ruled a suicide.

Sharon was also the "enforcer" for the leftist palmach before '48, beating Jews with a lead tipped whip if they joined Begin's Irgun.

You'll have to sell your crocodile tears for Jew beater elsewhere.

To top it all off, you write "is" M, not "will come back with techiat hameitim to be the Moshiach."

Thus, you believe both that the Rebbe is physically walking around olam hazeh and that we already have M (meaning that we were wrong to say J can't be M since there's still death, illness, war, etc).
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Unread 05-08-2006, 04:23 PM   #38
magdiel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frumkite
Even if Yediot denied a fact it would be far from a source, but Yediot not mentioning a fact means that it must not be true?

Again, only Sharon's father was registered with the misrad ha'panim.

Sharon wrote that his parents were ostracized in the town they moved to (because of intermarriage, perhaps).

Sharon was inconsolable? Sharon was in the middle of an affair with his wife's sister and married that sister soon after the strange car accident.

The first sister's son was found shot to death with Sharon's gun soon after complaining about the whole situation. After an investigation of Sharon, it was ruled a suicide.

Sharon was also the "enforcer" for the leftist palmach before '48, beating Jews with a lead tipped whip if they joined Begin's Irgun.

You'll have to sell your crocodile tears for Jew beater elsewhere.

To top it all off, you write "is" M, not "will come back with techiat hameitim to be the Moshiach."

Thus, you believe both that the Rebbe is physically walking around olam hazeh and that we already have M (meaning that we were wrong to say J can't be M since there's still death, illness, war, etc).
I am replying only to avoid motzi shem Ra. Someone has sold you a bill of goods.
His son complained about an affair? He was eight years old!! The rebbe would not have sent special shluchim to him if what you claim is true.
The nephew is a Lubavitcher and he specifically said the rumour about the mother is not true. The article in Yediot detailed the whole family history and where they came from. They were the initial settlers of teh moshav.
I am no fan of his policies, but this is over the top.
Finally, did you know that Rabbi Kadouri ZTL said that Sharon is a Gibor of Israel,he saved many Jews, but fell for the wrong advice about Gaza(presumably from Olmert).
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Unread 05-08-2006, 04:29 PM   #39
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Torah 613"For Rebbe's descended from beis Dovid, you can add the present Satmar Rebbe's " How are they decended from BD? and which one are you nominating?
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Unread 05-08-2006, 04:33 PM   #40
Frumkite
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magdiel
I am replying only to avoid motzi shem Ra. Someone has sold you a bill of goods.
His son complained about an affair? He was eight years old!! The rebbe would not have sent special shluchim to him if what you claim is true.
The nephew is a Lubavitcher and he specifically said the rumour about the mother is not true. The article in Yediot detailed the whole family history and where they came from. They were the initial settlers of teh moshav.
I am no fan of his policies, but this is over the top.
Finally, did you know that Rabbi Kadouri ZTL said that Sharon is a Gibor of Israel,he saved many Jews, but fell for the wrong advice about Gaza(presumably from Olmert).
Nothing said in the name of R' Kaduri in the last 10 yrs is reliable.

Your buddy should speak to a rav about whether a gerut is necessary if he's from the wife's side (either wife since they were sisters).

And you want to believe that sharon was just gullible, go ahead. He put out a statement before his troops entered the Jewish homes that, "it's time to break bones."
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Unread 05-08-2006, 04:37 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magdiel
d that M does not have to be B.
BTW, r u Shemtov or related?Do you also have him on your short list?
Many ppl ,non Lubavitchers , asked me if Rabbi A .Shemtov was going to become the New Lubavitcher Rebbe.
I am sure that if they asked me, imagine how many ppl asked him about this .
Many ppl visualize him in this position ,and Lub is Moshiach , so you see that many ppl would have R Shemtov as a candidate
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Unread 05-08-2006, 05:05 PM   #42
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I'm surprised noone brought this up.
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Unread 05-08-2006, 05:42 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by TomimnotChakran
I'm surprised noone brought this up.
That was brought up in another thread and according to several members here, that website is a spoof intended to make a point.
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Unread 05-08-2006, 05:46 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DW Duke
according to several members here, that website is a spoof intended to make a point.
I think according to several members here, this thread is the same thing.
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Unread 05-08-2006, 05:54 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomimnotChakran
I think according to several members here, this thread is the same thing.

Thank you for saying this.

I can't believe it took this long.

LOL.
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Unread 05-08-2006, 06:27 PM   #46
Torah613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magdiel
Correction; i never asserted that M does not have to be Ben achar Ben; I merely questioned the Torah sources put forward that did not back this up. Since then I asked someone I respect, a Satmar?breslover Talmud Chacham, and he is of the opinion that Ramabm Hilchos Melochim about regular jewish Kings(Perek Daled,i think) does apply.
BTW, r u Shemtov or related?Do you also have him on your short list?
Shucks! There goes my messianic aspirations...
I actually do not have a list at all.
Am I related (or him)? Hmmmmm.....
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Unread 05-08-2006, 06:32 PM   #47
Torah613
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Originally Posted by magdiel
Torah 613"For Rebbe's descended from beis Dovid, you can add the present Satmar Rebbe's " How are they decended from BD? and which one are you nominating?
The one that just died was a descendent from the AR IIRC. However I cannot tell you how - for that you will have to ask a Satmar chosid (though if not being ben achar ben is a problem .... ).
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Unread 05-08-2006, 06:55 PM   #48
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Lightbulb

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maskil
If the qualifications are limited to those ideals considered necessary by Chabad Chassidus, (putting to the side any 'Dor Shvii' issues,) Moshiach would have to be someone who is comfortable with the concept of Hafotzas Mayanos HaBaal Shem Tov. That wouldn't necessarily mean he has to be an expert himself. But if Moshiach told the Besht that he would come K'sheyafutzu...and everyone could do yichudim, then it stands to reason that Moshiach would have to be someone who approves of the Mayanos Habesht!

It should also be mentioned that Moshiach does not have to be the biggest Talmid Chochom or Lamdan in the world. The Rambam says he has to be Hogeh BaTorah, not the brightest Rosh Yeshiva around. Bar Kochba was not one of the Tannaim quoted in Mishnayos or Beraysos. Apparently, R'Akiva was a bigger Talmid Chochom than the man he considered to be B'Chezkas Moshiach. That should open the field wide, and stop stam people from limiting their thinking about Chief Rabbis, Roshei Yeshiva and Admorim. It might be a frum military leader, or stam a learned balebos who will take upon himself the task when the time comes.

Of course, it never hurts to point out that the Rebbe himself said that there is no point in even dealing with this issue.
what do you mean when the time comes???
don't you know that moshiach has to bring back all the yidden to torah and mitzvos etc. as stated by the rambam, while still in golus?!
did anybody do or is doing that other then the rebbe?
don't you realize that moshiach is the ultimate jew, for whom the whole world was created for?!
I can't even fathom how you can suggest anyone other then the rebbe, and now the rebbe is only waiting for us to pick ourselves up on our own two feet and be mekabel the rebbe as moshiach as explained in the thread gimmel tammuz.
gimmel tammuz doesn't mean its over... it just (on gimmel tammuz) started!!!
what does anybody have to comment on the above?
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Unread 05-08-2006, 10:43 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by wanthetruth
what does anybody have to comment on the above?
uhuh.
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Unread 05-08-2006, 10:52 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by wanthetruth
what do you mean when the time comes???
don't you know that moshiach has to bring back all the yidden to torah and mitzvos etc. as stated by the rambam, while still in golus?!
did anybody do or is doing that other then the rebbe?
don't you realize that moshiach is the ultimate jew, for whom the whole world was created for?!
I can't even fathom how you can suggest anyone other then the rebbe, and now the rebbe is only waiting for us to pick ourselves up on our own two feet and be mekabel the rebbe as moshiach as explained in the thread gimmel tammuz.
gimmel tammuz doesn't mean its over... it just (on gimmel tammuz) started!!!
what does anybody have to comment on the above?
How far above would you be seeking comment?
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